38 Degrees Logo38 Degrees Logo 38 Degrees Logo

NHS get-togethers: more information

September 27th, 2012 by


NHS Get-together

Members get-together to save the NHS

38 Degrees members across the country are now organising local get-togethers in pubs, cafes and community centres.

They’ll be discussing how we can make sure our local doctors protect our NHS, and prevent privatisation as much as possible. Our people-powered push will counter the massive pressure which CCGs will be under from private health care companies.

There are over 200 CCGs across the country. The aim is for 38 Degrees members to meet in each of these, so no area goes unprotected.

For more information and support on this next stage of the campaign to protect the NHS locally, click here.

Posted in 38 Degrees Blog Posts, Stand up for the NHS

  • Rosie

    LOOK AT http://www.openDemocracy.net for ”How the BBC betrayed the NHS”

  • NHSwillyouSAVEIT?

    THE PHS:- private health service ! ,,,, land mark case sets precdent in high court ! if students did not obey tuion fee law,ie pay fee’s they would have won case,,,sets for all future law cases as proven by this case that if one person does not obey any law it gets struck off,its DEAD ! what makes the body of law,the roman,grek,and bible,,in bible it says justice is for free,the great con !

  • NHSwillyouSAVEIT?

    the competiton is not fair,the private contracts will get used only ! by commisoning groups buying care ! as private is quality at low price,or is it? and the fancy facilities,,,oviously the commisioning groups will like private over NHS CARE THEN ! REALLY LEVEL AND equal acccess to care….

  • NHSwillsaveorNONO?

    whats chance of wining in courts,zero,as ancient egtyian law turned into roman saturn as satan law,,this law is in fact all statute laws today,our western system,as jus civilus,civilum or ome rack of rubbish ! al laws are satanic hence illegal.anyway….

  • Anonymous

    I have set up an epetition to ask for an enquiry into government ministers connecdtions with private healthcare companies. For some reason when I put a link to the petition my message gets removed. The number on the govt. website is 40126.
    Please sign it.

  • Anonymous

    I have just received an email from 38 degrees asking me to set up a CCG meeting in my area. I have written on here before about my CCG.
    My local GP practice has the chair of the CCG. The meeting was set up before the ordinary population could go to it. It was arranged for people in the know. Derwentside is a Virgin area and has been for over 3 years. The CCG was set up in October last year.
    You can only be a lay member of the CCG providing you agree with CCGs!
    I have asked 38 degrees to ask members to sign up to my epetition to look into links between govt. ministers and private healthcare companies. They have ignored this.
    I will ignore their request to go along to my local CCG.

  • Anonymous

    I have just read that the BMA are suggesting patients use the opt out card for GP surgeries to say that they only want to go to NHS services. The problem is that many of us already belong to NHS services/surgeries half owned by private companies.
    So how do we opt out? Nearly the whole of Durham and Darlington is owned by Virgin. We cannot opt out. However, many people living in this area do not know.
    It is not on the information packs given out by the GP surgery when you join. It should be.
    Perhaps this is another area that we should campaign about.
    The population is 66 million. 7 million have signed up to something on 38 degrees. What about the rest of the population? How do we let them know?

  • William

    Remember GPs are private contractors. So the arguments about privatisation are irrelevant . We should be focussing on getting better , faster and cheaper (all three together) healthcare. The current NHS services cannot deliver that in many cases. Do not force continuation of inadequate services . Drive for something better. Hence evaluate carefully any alternatives

  • William

    That means you cannot go to a GP. They are private and not part of the NHS family

  • William

    Many CCGs like ours has a strong patient and public participation group. Their view are taken on board by the CCG and acted upon. Get involved with the PPPGs there you can have a real voice for change and improve services rather than just trying to save many inadequate services . Drive for better healthcare not protect old Spanish practices that exist in many of the care providers

  • Anonymous

    Oh well, I’ll just have to die then shall I? A surgeon removed my thyroid gland 30 years ago thinking I had cancer. I didn’t have. I now have thyroxine every day to stay alive. So I cannot go to a GP and get a prescription.
    What I’d like to know is how did we allow the NHS to get in this state.

  • Anonymous

    My mother was a nurse before the NHS came into being. Her father died because they could not afford medication for him. They were not that poor; her mother was a headmistress.
    I do not wish to go back to that, thank you.
    I have tried to look at the finances of our CCG and cannot. Confidential. That cannot be right. I wanted to know under the FOI act about Virgin Care’s contracts and their value in nthe County Durham and Darlington NHS.
    It is not possible to find out.
    I have asked for an epetition to ban companies involved in tax dodging from being eligible for public/nhs contracts.
    It has been turned down.
    I have just received a newspaper from County Durham about changes in the NHS.
    It says that CCGs are groups of nurses, GPs and other health professionals. When I looked at being a lay person I could only do it if I believed in what CCGs are about.
    Most people on 38 degrees do not, so will not be eligible.

  • Anonymous

    have a look at this jen[I'm posting it up in different places.I think it's major,major stuff from the Stroud against cuts campaign in Gloucester:

    'this comment in comment is free from the commenterRememberBhopal-it's dynamite:
    'The NHS is not legally required to put services out to competitive tender:

    1. NHS Commissioning Board Briefings for Clinical Commissioners:

    Procurement of healthcare (clinical) services: Briefings for CCGs - published: 14 September, 2012
    Third PDF:
    “Briefing 2: What are the procurement options?”
    Published 14 September 2012 http://www.commissioningboard.nhs.uk/files/2012/09/procure-brief-2.pdf
    see page 3:

    “What sort of a procurement route is appropriate?
    “The main procurement routes available to you are:

    · to open the service to Any Qualified Provider (AQP) and enable patients to choose from these providers;

    · competitive tendering process to appoint a specific provider, a specified number of providers or collaboration of providers; or

    · appoint a specific provider or group of providers without competition (Single Tender Action).”

    2.. Dr John Lister, NHS doctor in London explained this two weeks ago on his website:http://www.healthemergency.org.uk/diary.php says (October 2012):

    “GPs and CCGs are NOT compelled to put services out to tender, or to open them up to Any Qualified Provider. This is made very clear in the NHS Commissioning Board’s own ‘Briefing on Procurement of healthcare (clinical) services’ published last month.

    “There are three options for procuring services:

    · any qualified provider (AQP), which gives GPs no control whatever, and no guarantees of quality, as “patients will decide which providers to be referred to”

    · competitive tendering, which does allow GPs to assess rival bids from NHS and other providers and to choose the most suitable; and

    · “appoint a specific provider or group of providers without competition (Single Tender Action)”.

    “Of the three, the worst in every respect is AQP: so why are GPs and CCGs allowing themselves to be led into it? It is more urgent than ever for campaigners, health unions the BMA and the Royal College of GPs to remind CCGs that they have been told they have a choice, and they should clearly choose now, in advance, to reject AQP. If enough CCGs take a stand, it will encourage others, and restrict the areas where AQP can be implemented. If this triggers a clash with the Commissioning Board, it will be a useful and educational test of strength that will also expose to all GPs and the wider public the extent to which the NHS is being hijacked by the private sector. The fight is one that must be waged on all fronts: we have to resist cuts and closures, challenge and fight privatisation, demand PFIs are brought back into public ownership, repel attacks on the national pay and conditions of health workers, and do everything possible to blunt the impact of the Health & Social Care Act.”

    2. On 8 October, the Chairman of the National Association of Primary Care Dr Charles Alessi says that nobody is obliged to use Any Qualified Provider.:


    “PCTs ready to expand any qualified provider policy this month” Marina Soteriou, 08 October 2012

    The Department of Health is quoted as saying:

    “Providers will only be able to refused by commissioners if they reject the price offered, refuse to agree to local standards or to comply with pathways and referral thresholds, or if they fail quality standards.”

    But the Chairman of the National Association of Primary Care and Surrey GP Dr Charles Alessi says that:

    "...there were a lot of misconceptions about AQP. ‘It is not a bidding process,’ he said. ‘Nobody is forcing anybody to use AQP.
    “’From April, it will be up to the clinical commissioning groups (CCGs) whether they wish to use AQP or not.”

    3. The lawyers for Stroud Against the Cuts, Leigh Day, explained that there is a difference between law and policy.

    It is conservative party policy that NHS services have to be opened up to competitive tender on the open market, it is not the law.

    There is no legal requirement on local NHS managers to put services up for tender on a competitive market.

    This may have not been correctly explained to CCGs. It may be a misunderstanding. It may be that CCGs have to do what the Department of Health tells them, unless they have evidence from local residents:

    Press release for Stroud Against the Cuts: http://stroudagainstcuts.co.uk/fightback/healthcarecuts.html

    "In May, health ministers conceded [7] and the PCT accepted [8] …that creating an NHS Trust was an option, and that there was no legal requirement on local health bosses to put services up for tender. ”

    Write to your CCG and PCT and tell them you don’t want this.

    Recommend? (0)
    Responses (0)

  • Anonymous

    Your argument is false. We are concerned about further privatisation and doctors who carry out private work to the detriment of their NHS patients.

  • Anonymous

    Not true.

  • Anonymous

    How can you say that the arguments about privatisation are irrelevant when GPs are selling out of hours services and becoming millionaires. Do you think that is acceptable? I think lots of people in the NHS were shocked by that.

  • Anonymous

    Have printed it off and will write to the CCG and find out how they stand. My GP surgery is asking for people to join the Patient Participation Group, but the thought of sitting in the same room as the GP who told my husband he was greedy when he was diagnosed with a brain tumour makes my stomach churn. I am afraid that at the moment I would not be objective, or responsible for my actions.

  • Anonymous

    Two other things. Does the new NHS statement by Hunt say anything about this? I tried to download it from the DoH website, but it would not let me – and I have downloaded PDFs since then.
    The other thing is, what has happened about Virgincare letting GPs off their contracts? My GP surgery was half owned by Virgin. GPs were allowed to give up these contracts because of conflict of interest with them being on CCGs. But then what happened? Because it seems to me that logically Branson owns them 100%. That’s not what was wanted, but I cannot find any information about it anywhere.
    Do you know? Virgincare website does not seem to have changed to reflect the new order of things.

  • Anonymous

    Can you change GPs?Excercise your consumer choice[care of the tories]Seems like you have a lot of good questions[re:Virgincare] the answers to which might be quite interesting.If it is stated[above]:

    ‘It is conservative party policy that NHS services have to be opened up to competitive tender on the open market, it is not the law.


    There is no legal requirement on local NHS managers to put services up for tender on a competitive market.’

    To me this sounds like a game changer.

    It sounds like patient choice along with GP cooperation can determine whether private health care providers are used…or not.

    You’ll be an asset.Dont let the bastards win.
    Sounds like with all the information to hand,Patient Participation Groups could become major players,and should their GPs be less agreeable,Hey,it’s a market situation[now],and people can vote with their feet.
    GPS who accommodate NHS-friendly PPGs[hopefully most of them]will be in the ascendant.In any case it is up to the patient[s].
    I’m beginning to think that because this alien tory ediface,the H&SC Bill/ACT is premised on patient/consumer choice,it’s maybe through informed patient/consumer choice,that it’s aspirations to become the gateway to free-market cut-throatery will crumble.
    Dreams are controllable,reality is and can become very messy.

  • Anonymous

    I think the legal testing of the of the mandate and the H&SC Bill /act may have unexpected results.That’s what Stroud against the Cuts:


    did.This seems to me fertile ground, and with crowd-funding,eminently possible.

    Just got this from his forward to the mandate:

    Hunt::’This mandate – the first of its kind in the world – underlines my responsibility as Health Secretary to preserve and defend those principles to which we all remain indebted.’



    Obviously he talks differently to his direction of travel.The NHS is not safe in his or the tories’ hands.

    More from his forward:

    ‘and by focusing on the things that people tell us matter most,’

    The tories,lansley and now hunt really didn’t care what mattered most to people.They drove the Bill through and over loud and varied protest.This stuff is just the velvet glove of the iron fist of the private sector.

    Reading this and bearing in mind Eoin Clarkes research above:

    ['Hunt called for the NHS to be dismantled as it was "no longer relevant".

    'His co-author in the same publication entitled Direct Democracy was Daniel Hannan who sparked outrage when he called the NHS, "A 60 year mistake"]

    makes me doubt his sincerity and every lovely word he utters.

    As for virgin care,I dont know too much about that.Following Eoin Clarke’s research.There is,is there?,a silence there[virgincare,must have been a set back,at least]

    I downloaded a copy no problem from:


  • Anonymous

    Because the tories are transforming healthcare[the NHS] into a market place,if there are sufficient people/patients in an area,a GP can be invited in to service those people not happy with their present provider.There are a lot of doctors who may be sympathetic who would love the opportunity to run their own practise-no mistake.The market place is a hard task master.

  • Anonymous

    Unfortunately my GP practice was a pathfinder and every practice in Derwentside was in the group so there is nowhere to go. There are 3 GPs in the practice, one of whom is the chair of the CCG and the other, the horrible one, is in charge of prescriptions in Tyne and Wear, which is a laugh because whenever my husband went in to ask for a repeat prescription, this GP was so distracted we came out without what we went in for and had to ask at the desk. Now we know why.
    The third GP is very nice and she is the one I would go to if I needed to.
    It seems to me that the only chance there is now is the National Health Action Party, although we would not get an MP up here as ours is Labour. She’s proper Labour and seems to agree with us about the NHS.
    However I have just noticed my epetition is trending, so there is another hope, though not through 38 Degrees.
    How do we get them to be better organised?
    I’ll try again to download the Hunt paper. Maybe I tried too early before it was set up properly.
    There is another epetition which states that private providers of public services should be subject to the FOI Act. This covers Virgincare. and Care UK, which is having to borrow the money to pay those GPs their millions. That stinks as well.

  • Anonymous

    Maybe you’ve seen this.It’s the/a cure or a major part of it.Amazing!


    Here’s an extract:

    ‘ As David Lock, the QC who represented Michael Lloyd in court, said the decision to set up a standalone NHS Trust at this stage represents a ‘potential policy shift’ which could be of particular significance for community services (district hospitals, health visitors, and so on) elsewhere, some of whom are in temporary contracts and may otherwise have faced re-tendering. But this shift will only happen, if campaigners push for it.’


    ‘But of course there is heavy, often secretive political pressure from above to privatise (either through tendering, or through ‘Any Qualified Provider’) – and to do so as quietly as possible. As a result, health bosses aren’t always quick to admit the amount of discretion they do have’


    ‘It is more likely that health bosses will stand up for the NHS if they are under pressure from their local community and health workers. Campaigners can encourage health bosses to use the promises of ‘patients first’ and ‘clinically led’ to insist on having the right to keep services public, if people feel that is best (see our campaign guide for more details).’

  • Anonymous

    I signed your petition,Jen.Well done!The whole thing is corrupt,and the government simply doesn’t care.Unbelievable.I’m going to sign that other one.The more petitions revolving around the Bill/Act the better.You dont know it’s address?

  • Anonymous

    Sorry I do not, but the wording is Private providers, etc., so just search for that. Another one I have found out today is about tax havens, which I have signed. Its link is http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/34177
    I have discovered that when Derwentside was taken over by Virgin Care it was done under Any Willing Provider. Not sure how legal that ever was, because it was changed in the bill before it became law.
    Something else to ask the CCG. They will probably say it does not matter as they are no longer part of the consortium.
    I find a lot of the information on False economy, which has good links and is searchable.

  • Anonymous
  • Anonymous

    I went to an NHS GET-TOGETHER a week ago and still haven’t received an update from the person who organised this meeting.